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Post by BrightEyes05 on May 24, 2004 22:12:25 GMT -5
Again, the faults are in the people, not the system itself. Its not the love of the money itself that corrupt individuals grow to love, its the power that they believe it bestows upon them.
Money is meant to symbolize the accomplishment of an individual. If an individual has achieved alot of money, then he has accomplished very much (assuming this is in a capitalist society, void of corruption spoken of earlier).
Its not money that capitalism glorifies, but individual rights and accomplishment.
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 24, 2004 23:08:06 GMT -5
yes, but if the system doesn't take into consideration the flaws in human nature, than the system itself is flawed and not usable. that's why comunism is wrong, that's why socialism is wrong, and that's why capitalism is wrong. you have to mix and cover all flaws in humans inorder to make a system that really works. you can't claim the system works when it doesn't work in within the bounds it was meant to work in. meaning, because humans are flawed, and capitalism was created to work with humans, it's essentially flawed because it doesn't work with humans. mixed economy is the way to go no matter how you look at it. all this is just wishful thinking.
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Post by Josh on May 24, 2004 23:10:36 GMT -5
The bible was written by flawed men, but you don't have any problem accepting it as a perfect text.
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Post by BrightEyes05 on May 24, 2004 23:17:56 GMT -5
That was quite a good one.
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 0:51:47 GMT -5
no it really wasn't. I put faith into the fact that the bible is God's word. recorded by men. but from God. That distingueses all accusations of it being flawed because it doesnt' come from the hearts or minds of man, but from God. the only human flaws that show through are technical errors in writing. that is quite different from this case where the very concept is formed in the hearts of man and not adequte to be practiced by men.
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Post by Monkey Bone on May 25, 2004 2:12:36 GMT -5
when i have shown bible passages that show it is flawed, your too blind to see it. ANd still you haven't read it
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 2:53:45 GMT -5
ANd still you haven't read it you know what would be a really fun game! counting how many time you've said that to me! can you even guess? I think I lost count a while ago. and all you have shown me so far is 'typos', writing/copy errors, and that verse in Genesis that you simply don't understand. nothing in the nature of the message and nothing that even deals with the main point of the book.
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Post by Monkey Bone on May 25, 2004 3:01:31 GMT -5
you know what would be a really fun game! counting how many time you've said that to me! can you even guess? I think I lost count a while ago. and all you have shown me so far is 'typos', writing/copy errors, and that verse in Genesis that you simply don't understand. nothing in the nature of the message and nothing that even deals with the main point of the book. all you show me is a few skipped verses you use together to help your meaning out, and you really look stupid arguing the bible and never read it, I really feel you should have to read that at least every post till you deciede to fucking do it
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 3:16:59 GMT -5
I am reading it, sweetie. don't think that I purposefully neglect it. sheesh. and I didn't skip any verses in genesis. you're just not reading the sentences correctly.
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Post by Josh on May 25, 2004 11:37:55 GMT -5
no it really wasn't. I put faith into the fact that the bible is God's word. recorded by men. but from God. That distingueses all accusations of it being flawed because it doesnt' come from the hearts or minds of man, but from God. the only human flaws that show through are technical errors in writing. that is quite different from this case where the very concept is formed in the hearts of man and not adequte to be practiced by men. Funny, it looks like any other book to me. I don't see anything to make me believe it was actually written by God. I mean, I've read Greek mythology which was also inspired by the gods or the muses. I don't see you putting much faith in that.
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Post by Monkey Bone on May 25, 2004 11:52:01 GMT -5
I am reading it, sweetie. don't think that I purposefully neglect it. sheesh. and I didn't skip any verses in genesis. you're just not reading the sentences correctly. what happened to 15 and 16 and what about all the other verses I had to post to show problems
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 18:56:24 GMT -5
Funny, it looks like any other book to me. I don't see anything to make me believe it was actually written by God. I mean, I've read Greek mythology which was also inspired by the gods or the muses. I don't see you putting much faith in that. bible prophecies have confirmed in me that it is infact the word of God. if you don't believe, fine, you don't have to. but because I do believe that it does come from God, and because it is useable and good for every human life, than it is put on a whole different level than your capitalism theory. that is the point I'm trying to make.
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 19:04:42 GMT -5
what happened to 15 and 16 and what about all the other verses I had to post to show problems ah. I thought you were talking about the creation thing. 15 and 16 were just noah building the ark. i didn't think they had any significant point to what we were argueing so I didn't put them in. less for you to read. and what about all the other verses you had to post to show problems?
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Post by BrightEyes05 on May 25, 2004 19:08:28 GMT -5
First off, that was me who was arguing for Capitalism, not Master Bates.
Second, if humans are flawed, then how can we ever compensate for that with any system of social reform? After all, we can try and try to achieve perfection, which by definition is impossible, since we are flawed by nature, right?
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hambakmeritru
Junebug
take away the imidiate present and what is left?
Posts: 462
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Post by hambakmeritru on May 25, 2004 19:23:18 GMT -5
First off, that was me who was arguing for Capitalism, not Master Bates. oops. theres too many people working against me! I'm getting them all mixed up! *whinecrywhine* and no system will ever work perfectly, but a mixed economy is more adequet, I think because it helps cover more problems in human nature. a little more control, a little more care, a little more equality, a little more freedom than the other extreme.
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